What size luh bolts used on a Vintage Speedster?

Hi ALl -

I have 2006 Vintage with wide fives, a front disc brake conversation and the aluminum brake covers. Anyone know if the car is running 12 or 14mm diameter lug bolts? I think they are standard VW bug, but want to be sure before I order a replacement.

I have called VS 4 times in two weeks - cant reach them or get a call back....

 

Thanks Scott S

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Gordon Nichols posted:

HOW THE HELL ARE WE SUPPOSED TO KNOW??????????????

Take out a lug bolt or remove a lug nut, whichever you have, and truck your butt down to a tire store and ask what the hell it is........It's that simple.

Give him h*ll, Gordon!

Oh, and PS- Lug nuts for the VW 4x130mm pattern are also 14mm.

 

Gordon Nichols posted:

...HOW THE HELL ARE WE SUPPOSED TO KNOW??????????????...

 

Damn, it's so refreshing seeing the occasional reply that's not politically correct.

If you think about it, this is a solid, reasonable response to half the questions that get asked around here.

This might have brought a timely conclusion to the 'What's The Best Oil' thread that's currently following its inevitable course on another SOC channel.

I don't know just what kind of knot your knickers are in, Gordon (and don't want to know), but here, here!

 

 

Pills my a$$!  

Al, you don't know what the hell he has on there.  I have 14mm on my 4-lug hubs and 14mm on the adapters, but he has (supposedly) wide 5 hubs which could be 12mm or could be 14mm and you certainly don't know what the thread pitch is until you put a thread  pitch gauge to them because you don't know who drilled/tapped the hubs for the studs or bolts.

Somewhere along the line these new guys (or even old guys) have to get over asking dumb questions, take responsibility for their cars and learn how to take care of them!

Look, Scott......   What you are asking is impossible for us to know.  Why?  Because you have "wide fives, a front disc brake conversation and the aluminum brake covers".     God only knows what was used in that conversion by someone we don't know and we certainly don't have a clue without being there and measuring the studs or bolts to figure it out.  Only YOU can do that, so remove a lug bolt or lug nut, go to a tire store or a decent mechanic or (even better) a decent machine shop and find out what they are.  Ed's suggestion is good, too.  Try Home Depot. 

It remains that simple.

 

Wow.

Lets add a bit of backstory to this little rant shall we?

My car is close to an hour away. Due to schedule, the absolute soonest I will be able to get there will be the week of December 3rd. Having recently decided to throw some money into this car, I have created a list of projects/parts and thought I would get things ordered in advance.

My pan is a 1967 - the transition year from what I can see at most of the parts houses. I have called VS  times in the past week to both order parts (bumpers/hardware/door panels) as well as to inquire what disc brake system they usually use/what the lug bolt size it. I cannot reach them or get a call back on my voicemails. Being that so many cars on this forum appear to have similar underpinnings and that many are familiar with VS builds, seemed like an easy place to go for that "dumb" information. This appears to have been an incorrect assumption on my part.

As far "learning how to take care of my car", this toy is currently sitting in my shop, with 20 other cars, all of which I have either built, restored or maintain. The only thing I farm out when needed is final paint. Your statement is an incorrect assumption on your part (pic attached).

Really was excited to spend time improving this car. Having recently sold two other Porsches, I figured this place would be a great new community to get involved with - like the past 17 years has been over at Pelican. 

So Gordon, I will take your advice. I am over it. Completely.

Best Wishes -

 

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XXXX,

I'm not speaking for Gordon, but for myself.  All of us on this and other forums we frequent can be guilty of mixing up the numbered mantra of 1, 2, 3-ready, aim, fire.  I have personally changed the sequence to ready, fire, aim on occasion on this forum, much to my later regret.

I'm not trying to talk you into staying, just saying that this forum does have a great bunch of guys, who occasionally exhibit human failings, putting myself at the very top of that list.  Sometimes the events of the day influence your responses, not always in a positive way.

I saw from your profile that you joined our community 7 years ago, but haven't been very active.  We all have something to contribute.  Please consider more participation, not less.  Best of luck in whatever you decide.

Hello XXXX,

My guess is that Kirk used the AC Industries disc kit which is available from numerous aftermarket VW suppliers. If it is the 67 wide 5 kit, it uses the 12 x 1.5. This is what I'm currently running on my car. I don't gamble but I would bet that is whats on that silver car if its using the same AC Industries kit.

As VSpyder added, 14 x 1.5 would require someone to have drilled and tapped the rotors. Now... That's all assuming it is using the ac industries kit. If the builder used the more expensive disc kit that uses a two piece rotor with an integrated hub adaptor (coolrydes cool stop or one of the wilwood based Bad Series kits by Airkewld) then it would well use a 14 x 1.5. If Kirk built your car I highly doubt he went that route unless specifically asked to do so.  356 Porsche wide 5 drums all used 14x1.5mm (as Alan said). Did Kirk build you car and you bought it new? Or did you get it used? If used, it's hard to say how authentic the previous owner went.

As you are aware there are different style lugnuts for different wheels. The early bug (and I believe porsche wheels) use the 60 degree Acorn style nut. The wheels on my car were set up for 14mm acorn style nuts (not round or flat bottom). I used the 12mm studs and nuts without any ill side effects. The wheels on the silver outlaw appear to be original Lemmerz 356 wheels. Those use acorn nuts. Make sure you get acorn style nuts.

There are so many variables that it's really hard to be 100% sure. I would venture a relatively safe guess that those are 12x1.5mm lugnuts.

Sorry we couldn't give a definitive answer.

 

 

People come on here again and again (and again) asking questions that they could answer themselves with either a little bit of searching or simply going and checking their own car, so I understand Gordon's (over) reaction. It is frustrating when people don't take the time to figure it out themselves, so you can see what happened. Not that it makes it any better, but if you had mentioned that the car wasn't exactly just out in the garage, Gordon would probably not have jumped all over you. I apologize for my dumb-ass friend (XXXX- don't read this part- Gordon- yeah, I said that, but I'm only trying to make things better here and I think our friendship is strong enough that you won't take this the wrong way, and I'll buy the first 2 beers and tequila shots when we finally meet!) and I'm sure he will in the morning as well. Don't give up on us yet- you may just find us quite the likeable bunch 

Al. Ohh boy.... 

Scott:

I apologize for being quick-triggered and rude.  You didn't deserve it.  You were just trying to get it right.

The good and bad part of these cars is that, even from the same builder, like VS, we don't know what the original buyer asked for with custom or different parts, and then, once delivered they tend to get "upgraded" by the subsequent owners.  Just for front brakes sets, there are 4 or 5 different manufacturers out there that get used and then, depending on the year they're trying to replicate, they could go with wheel bolts or studs at 12mm or 14 mm.   So you can see that it is difficult, at best, for us to guess what is on there without actually measuring it.

The first reply, from Al Merklin, was probably spot on and they are probably 14mm X 1.5, the standard VW wheel bolt size.  Bear in mind that the bolt heads are probably VW ball-style to fit the depression in the wheel, not cone-shaped.  

I guess I should have kept my fingers off the keyboard and gone to bed earlier.  Sorry.  I'll just shut up unless I have something positive to contribute, and you're right - This is a good group (my tirade notwithstanding) with a lot to give.  Don't let me turn you off on the rest of us.

Gordon

Cool shop, Scott. That's the thing you should've led in with. As you can see, we're all pretty craven here, and so a post saying "here's my shop, and here's my question," would have gotten us all off on the right foot: a wild & lengthy thread drift on the subject of shop envy. 

There would have been digressions on shop heat, British cars, Lucas electrics, "my new house" and "best lifts."

You'd still not have an answer to your question, of course. But that's how things usually go here!

How about people on here just quit being an A$$ to people they think are asking dumb questions. I was taught the only dumb question is the question you don't ask. Now granted, if someone comes on and has 10 dumb questions in a row and it's obvious they aren't putting any effort into trying to learn, then a harsh response might be necessary.

IF you think a question is dumb and doesn't deserve an answer, don't answer it, don't go all PCA on him by being rude. No one knows anyone else's circumstances or why they're asking what seemingly appears to be a question with an easy answer. Scott's situation is a perfect example. Sure, take a lug nut or the stud off the car and trip on down to the store, IF YOU HAVE THE CAR IN FRONT OF YOU. 

I'm not going to apologize for any rudeness you given, the one who inflicted the rudeness upon you owes you that, and it appears he's eating up some crow pie right now. I will ask that you don't judge the rest of the group here based on that.

I know I've asked a lot of dumb questions on this site.  Some times its because I really don't have a clue and some times its because I don't have the time or don't want to make the time to find the answer.  I'm not a dumb person.  I'm just not as educated about these cars as other folks.  We are all educated about certain things and ignorant about others.  I'd just like to think that I can ask just about anything and not be criticized. Maybe poked fun at a bit but not criticized. 

So welcome to the club Scott.  Hope you stick around.

And in Gordon's defense when I was installing European tail lights to my car and trying to figure out the new wiring I called Gordon on the phone and asked lots of dumb questions.  He was very gracious and kind.  But maybe this time a chill pill was in order...Doctor's orders.

TRP posted:

Wide 5 and 67 had 12 x 1.5mm if im not mistaken. Ball is correct for a bug wheel. Now Im wondering if i have cones or ball type lugnuts on my car?! 

(This gets comfusing quickly!)

Ted,

I have 67 drums on the back of my car and it has 12mm x 1.5 threaded holes.  I am using 12mm studs and ball seat lug nuts.  I think all the old Porsches and VWs used ball seat lugs, either 12mm or 14mm. 

BTW, Honda uses 12mm ball seat lug nuts with a 19mm hex.  This is what I am using on my car.  My CB front discs also have 12mm x 1.5 studs.  @TRP

James 

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