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As Troy says, any number of scenarios are possible...again, I'm going on what I heard from Matt. As for Kirk's payout, the legal doc would say that he got some money upfront but the bulk was to be from ensuing royalty payments which were soon terminated (and the subject of the lawsuit). I'm guessing that judgment this June spelled the end for AZ. As for whether Kirk would be a secured creditor, that could be an obligation of the business or a personal obligation of the buyer, depending on the sale agreement - either way, tough to collect now

"Criminals already know the law, it's the squares like us that need to understand what the law can and can't do." - @Jim Kelly


Those of us that have owned businesses or dealt with unscrupulous business partners, or employees, have learned through that experience that 'what is right and what is law are two totally separate universes'.

Let me say that again...'what is right and what is law are two totally separate universes'.

In case I didn't make it clear enough...'what is RIGHT and what is LAW are two totally SEPARATE universes'.  

@GTman posted:

It probably would have a better shot of being bought out of bankruptcy if it was still in Hawaiin Gardens and still had Kirk's crew in place so that it would be more turnkey.

Yeah, with respect to that, there is a company in Hawaiian Gardens now. Vintage Motorcars, Inc. is the company. Greg Leach bought/leased the building and ALSO hired on all of Kirk's old employees who were left in the lurch by V-AZ.

Read that again: Greg hired on all of Kirk's employees who were left in the lurch by V-AZ between Christmas and New year's day about 5 years ago.

Vintage Motorcars, Inc, maker of pre-A 356 coupes, 356 Speedsters, and 550 Spyder replicas is run by Greg Leach since the early 90s. Greg used to be Vintage Spyders, and for his first 10 years or so, worked out of the exact same HG location that he is back to.

I'd say there is no need for anyone to buy any business. I hope the bankruptcy will pay off all buyers and creditors. Then let V-AZ go to the bottom of the dust-pile where it belongs. It's karma, starting off the way they did and moving out of state. Consequences.

Last edited by DannyP
@DannyP posted:

Yeah, with respect to that, there is a company in Hawaiian Gardens now. Vintage Motorcars, Inc. is the company. Greg Leach bought/leased the building and ALSO hired on all of Kirk's old employees who were left in the lurch by V-AZ...

That was such a smart move- no learning curve training new people.  It's turned out VERY well!

Not to make light of a terrible situation for everybody who's owed something by these AZ charlatans... but at the very minimum, this should finally eliminate the befuddlement of having two nearly identically named companies (Vintage Motorcar and Vintage Motorcars) each building "Vintage Speedsters" with bodies laid up by Greg Leech's guys using different molds (the subject of the linked lawsuit). It's enough to make even experienced guys corn-foozed.

Now, if we could figure out some alternative naming for the guy selling re-pop Chinese trim pieces (Vintage Speedster Parts) and Ming's company (Vintage Speed) we'd be getting somewhere.

Last edited by Stan Galat


Speaking of Vintage Speedster Parts, they still show these in the catalog:


I'm thinking this will one day be worth more than the easy-to-find P-Car badge. They're only replicas once! Twenty years from now, they'll be making cheap copies of these in someplace like Wisconsin, and to think you can still buy the Chinese originals for bubkas!

I should probably scoop up all the remaining stock and corner the market.



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Last edited by Sacto Mitch


"The quality is going in before the name is going on"

It is indeed, Stan.

Here is my own VS badge, which my car still wears proudly:


At one point I toyed with the idea of replacing it with a P-Car badge, as so many of my less secure brothers have done. But eventually, I thought, we all must take responsibility for our actions. We must man up. Was I ashamed of this car or proud of it, dammit?

The badge endures.

In time, I discovered a hidden feature of the badge that is probably little appreciated. Besides proclaiming its origins, this special badge also reveals to the world the provenance of the vehicle to which it is affixed.

After about 20K miles, one of the red stripes neatly peeled off. Not in a shabby way, but crisp and clean — revealing a neat gold bar underneath. My car was coming of age. It was maturing.

And then, after another 20K miles, a second red stripe peeled away and I had discovered the hidden Easter egg.

The badge records and proudly displays, if only to the cognoscenti, the car's total accumulated mileage, in a quiet, understated manner.

I drive my 'two-bar' VS with a pride of ownership not easily described, eagerly anticipating every mile, every oil change, every carb adjustment inevitably leading us to that hallowed third gold bar.



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Last edited by Sacto Mitch

Really gutted for those that lost money...

When England, Chesil went under they had over 50 cars ordered that customers lost their money for, plus hundreds of suppliers.

I've heard the new company took on various old members of the company, one of them a guy called simon Westwood , where most peoples anger was aimed at, but now they have all been fired by the new owner after only a month or so.

Must have found out Westwood and co had turned the brand toxic.

There is another new company in the UK called Sebring speedster, and they seem to have a different way to work, by not being too big and a pay as you build model.

I'm going to keep my hopes alive here at home first though, different regulations can complicate imports.

I wish Porsche themselves build one, it'll be expensive but at least get built.

On behalf of @Theron I’d like to admonish everyone to limit their posts to facts re: the bankruptcy. Impugning someone’s character and congratulating them on their upcoming prison wedding are all well and good, but it puts the website in a precarious position, legally.

Like I posted previously, you don’t need a case to sue someone into oblivion, only a lawyer that will to do the dirty work for you.

Man, I'll never understand why some of you are so afraid. Free speech is one of the protected rights in this nation. Go back, reread the only legal advice from an actual lawyer (Jim Kelly) earlier in this thread. There's nothing even close to libelous here.

These defrauded guys (fellow members) didn't "allegedly" lose money, they gave a guy money and got nothing but broken promises and BS. This is really their thread. I'm not comfortable with all the 3rd party keyboard warrior saber rattling, but I can understand being frustrated for these guys. There, but for the grace of God go any of us.

Thieves and charlatans love it when their deeds go unreported. Mold and infection thrive in darkness. Light is by far the best disinfectant.

Theron is a big boy. He can moderate his own website.

Last edited by Stan Galat
@dlearl476 posted:

Stan’s obviously never spent $100K and three years of his life defending himself from a bs defamation suit brought by someone who took offense to being called a liar over a misrepresented motorcycle from an online classified ad on a motorcycle forum and “called Saul.”  

I was going to let this pass, but I decided to answer it.

Firstly, I'm really sorry for what you endured. It's awful to be singled out by a sociopath.

I might get hit by a runaway bus while walking on the sidewalk, but that doesn't mean I'm going to hide under my bed in case it happens. Free speech is a bit like that - stuff can happen, but living in fear of an unwarranted and irrational lawsuit seems to me like a pretty lousy way to move through life.

As to the personal aspect of your post - respectfully, Dave, you've got no idea how much I (or anybody here) have or haven't had to pay for exercising the right to express an opinion, or to defend oneself against a frivolous lawsuit (or governmental overreach). But even given that - the people sharing their experiences are not expressing opinions, they're stating facts. Cancelled checks with nothing to show for it are infinitely (by definition) different than getting something you perceive to be less than you paid for.

One is subject to interpretation, one is not.

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