Registering a Vintage Speedster in MA

It is very difficult (and costly) to register a new build, pan-based car in Mass., but I have attached the process to use with RMV contact info.  I've also attached the Mass. process used for a frame-based car, as you might end up going that route before you're done.  Just understand that with a newly built engine the probability that you'll need an emissions waiver by going the salvage title route is almost certain and there is very little sympathy for replica owners in this state.   Please let us know how you end up.

You might also contact @Al Gallo out on the Cape as his process seemed to be easier than mine and he took a different route.  If you search on here for his username and "registration" from 2017 to current date you should see his posts.

Good luck.

@Gordon Nichols Is the process any easier if it is registered in California first as a VW?

I recommend you talk with Greg at Vintage. He has people he's worked with in just about every state. He's been doing this for a while and might be able to help you keep from making any mistakes that'll haunt you later in the process.  He definitely wants you to get it registered, so there's no margin in it for him to steer you wrong.  He's been a help to me in this regard in Oregon, which isn't as friendly as you'd think...

Robert:  It makes no difference here if it was previously registered in Cali.

Adam:  PM me with your email address and I'll add you to the email list of New England replica owners (about 20 so far).

I, too, would suggest you start with Greg at Vintage to get his take on how it's gone in Mass.  I don't know of any recent new Vintages here, but then we only see 10-20% of  owners on this forum, anyway.  Please be aware that there is a HUGE difference between registering a pan-based car with a more-or-less original engine and the same car with a new engine, and another huge difference between a pan car and a newly built frame car (also with new engine).  

The tipping point is any engine bought/built after 2011 has to meet current year emissions testing or get a waiver via a crush title (see Mass Registration Frame doc up above).  The gray area there is if it is a new engine build in an old case with VW serial number stamped on it.  You might be able to squeek that by, by insisting that it was a simple rebuild to the original 1,600 cc displacement (even better if you get a doc from the builder ascertaining that it is a 1,600 cc).  Nobody can tell engine displacement without opening up the engine to find out so nobody will ever do that.  Documentation is everything, here.  Nothing larger than the 1,600 cc was offered in a VW sedan/vert aircooled, so that's the largest you can say is in there. Any info beyond that should be via email or phone.

I recently changed from registering mine as a VW convertible to a replica of a '57 Porsche Speedster.  It made someone (I don't know who) in the Registry happy, but it was a PITA process.  At times I felt I should have just left it as a VW convertible but then you'd be subject to the RMV's "Inspection Police" and I honestly don't know what would happen with them.  Al Gallo or @Tom Marantz (He has a JPS Suby-coupe out in Northhampton) will have better info than me.

Good luck, Adam, and send me your email address in a PM - There are several people with either Speedsters or coupes (both pan based) and one new-frame, Subaru-powered Spyder here in Mass who might help.

Gordon

Oh....  And where do you live in Mass?

I'm surprised that MA doesn't have a better program for replicars, as they are home to the largest kit manufacturer in the world.  I would have thought that Factory Five would have brought some pressure to the legislature in that regard.

Replicas don't fit with the 5-year plan for the collective, and are the residual vestiges of a lower-order and barbarian individualistic society-- in short, transportation fit only for enemies of the state.

The only solution for them is more government. 

Rick, I worked closely with the Smith brothers and others at Factory Five to come up with what we thought was a great SEMA-style bill that would have made it very easy to register a replica in Mass, whether Super Car, Cobra, 356 or Hot Rod.   At the last minute our bill was tossed out and a substitute bill approved that has, as it's sole thrust, wording to keep "polluting" replicas out of the state by making the replicas meet a set of emissions rules dreamed up by lobbyists.  356 replicas based on VW parts ended up on the short end of the stick because the lobbyists didn't understand these cars at all - they were focused on the Factory Fives of the world.  In some ways it made registering "Hot Rod" cars more straight-forward, but it made a new-build  replica of an old car much harder to register.  It took all of us by surprise, introduced and voted on in a legislative session literally in the middle of the night.  

Also, if it is a "new build" with all new parts (assuming it is a new tube-frame car, here), the state considers it a new car, with a current year of manufacture, meaning that it has to meet today's emission regs even if it is basically the same as a 1970 VW.  The only way around that is to buy an older polluting car, crush it for the salvage title and apply that to your new car so that one polluter goes away and is replaced by another polluter so net zero pollution gain (see the frame process in the attachments above).  That's what Prarit Bhargava had to do with his Suby-Spyder.

A Factory Five build is VERY different.  Typically, they use a donor Mustang complete with the entire ECU and emissions system for that (Mustang's) year of manufacture (YOM).  It has to pass emissions for the engine YOM.  Since Mustangs came with a wide range of engines, you can find what you want out there for your Cobra/Supercar.  Also, since they've been around since 1964-1/2, you can find all sorts of "performance" engines out there before 2007 and they would all be emissions exempt (with some fast-talking and doc backup for the inspectors).  There are a few things to be careful of, but nothing too onerous.

No so with VW's.  The engines in either VWs or 356s ranged from 1,100cc to 1,600 cc's and that's it (except for the 4-series, which are exceedingly rare).  That's what you're stuck with to keep the RMV folks happy and definitely NOT what a lot of us are running.  Beyond that is the distinction between a pan car with original VIN dating back to the 60's and 70's which is approached by the RMV one way, and a newly fab'd space frame car with a new VIN which will always need a crush car title to waive emissions.  That's your two paths.

Personally, since Adam has a pan-based car with the original VIN, and after all I went through to change mine to Replica from stock VW, I would try going the VW registration route and see what happens, but would get input from other "Massholes" on here as well as Greg at VS and go from there.  That's why I put together the list of 356 replica owners in New England - to get different perspectives on how they've registered their cars here.  It ain't easy, but we're getting it done.

Well this is timely. I'm shooting for next week so this is god stuff. 

Mass is the WORST in so many ways. Blue Laws, traffic, miserable people. I often wonder WTF I live here. Must have done something terrible in a former life.  I was going to try to get away with a '72 VW registration as I've heard that before. 

I'll read above...

I'm on the south shore in Abington

dont come to Ca..all of the above ++

I can see that Stan is still on his usual anti-government rant so I'll just stay out of here (and here I thought this was a thread about registering a car.....  Silly me).

Adam, if you want more info to help you out, PM me with your email address and I'll introduce you to the Massachusetts Replica group.  Don't look for me on here after this.

Well, I'll take a shot at the VW route and let you know how it works out. Can't register anything fun until the virus is over (all places of pain and suffering -like RMVs) are closed unless it's an emergency. So I'm going to insure the thing and put my truck plate on it. 

Preparing my line "Of course it's a 72 VW -with some modifications." I can hear Gordon saying "Yeah right!"

Plus, I'm a big believer in the Greek gas stations. They usually don't care and just want to live life -no red tape. To this day, I search them out. 

I'm in Taunton and bought mine from a doctor that had it registered in RI as a 69 bug as its built on that pan, I did the same in Mass. and the only time anyone looked at the vin on the pan (near the seatbelt bolts) was the first time I had it inspected, now with the old mass reg. nobody cares.

@Gordon Nichols posted:

I can see that Stan is still on his usual anti-government rant so I'll just stay out of here (and here I thought this was a thread about registering a car.....  Silly me).

Adam, if you want more info to help you out, PM me with your email address and I'll introduce you to the Massachusetts Replica group.  Don't look for me on here after this.

... as you have explained at length what you have described as an extremely Byzantine and ridiculous process for registration in Massachusetts, @Gordon Nichols, I didn't think it was out of place on this thread. 

I'll try to limit myself to the approved narrative. Carry on.

Nothing wrong with what you said, Stan. 

Sounds like the way to go is to register it as a VW Bug. Put in an old 1600cc or smaller. After you get it through the MA red tape, build a bigger motor.

adam12,  I was lucky enough to buy my car used and titled in Oregon as a Porsche Replica.  It was built ( I think ) in about 1995 from a 1965 VW donor . When I registered the car in 2007 the Reg. person called Boston to find out the right way to get it on the road. She was very helpful and wanted me to drive my car legally because I told her that my wife bought me the car for Christmas and I was worried that I might not be able to put it on the road. True story.

When I got the title it said " Porsche Replica coupe red ".  The speedster is obviously not a coupe , so I had to get that straightened out. I actually waited a few years and had my insurance guy take care of it because he knew his way around the snake pit and I wanted to be able to sell the car and buy an IM from R.I. 

I found that if I wanted a frame based car I would have to jump through flaming hoops and go the crush a pre-1973 car route. The pre-1973 car would have to be owned and registered by me for a year and had to be registered in the last 5 years. Most running pre '73 cars are collectors themselves and would not likely be crush candidates.

Long story short, I decided to update my car a bit and drive it forever. ( my wife wouldn't let me sell it anyway ) I keep it registered and insured year round with a normal plate and drive it often as a daily driver on nice days.

My advise is to either let it be called a VW or maybe you could ask the builder to sell it titled as a used Porsche replica that he previously owned. Not sure about the legality of all this but I've never been asked about engine size either.  Good luck, brother!