@DannyP posted:Just burn her at the stake. You know you want to.
At first I thought you said, "just burn her at the Starke. You know you want to. lol
Its my dyslexia acting up again.
Dave
@Butcher Boy posted:At first I thought you said, "just burn her at the Starke. You know you want to. lol
Its my dyslexia acting up again.
Dave
Even BETTER!
While we're on the topic here...
I'd like to build a charcoal canister with activated charcoal for my vent tube. The one @JMM (Michael) linked would work perfectly, but costs about 10x what I want to spend to get this done. There are multiple articles and youtube videos regarding how to build one with PVC pipe, but the ones made with pipe look horrible and homemade.
I'm looking for some sort of jar or canister with a removable lid, roughly the size of a pop or beer can. There are plenty of screw-top continaers for cosmetics or the like, but they are awfully squatty for what I have in mind. I don't want glass -- aluminum or plastic would be OK, but a thin steel can with a removable top would be my preference. A quart paint can maybe, but I'd like it to be taller and thinner.
Ideas?
@Stan Galat, are you the same guy who is wiring up a complete EFI/ECU conversion on your T1 engine? The same guy who does dual plug conversions, runs CHT sensors and knows exactly what they mean, and knows VW carburetors and suspensions inside out and backwards, but can't find a tin can and some hose? I think a cog or two has slipped somewhere.
I guess.
@Stan Galat I was thinking we could repurpose one of those cheap aluminum oil vapor catch cans they sell on eBay. I've seen them for under $25. Probably have to fiddle with the interior piping to have the vent tube go to the bottom of the can under the charcoal, and the can itself vent out the top. That's what I was going to try to do.
@Sacto Mitch posted:.
Something like this ?
If this company doesn't have it somewhere in their catalog, it probably doesn't exist.
.
Stan:
Get a case. That way you have 258 chances to get it right, or sell 257 of them once you've perfected the prototype.
@Stan Galat posted:While we're on the topic here...
I'd like to build a charcoal canister with activated charcoal for my vent tube. The one @JMM (Michael) linked would work perfectly, but costs about 10x what I want to spend to get this done. There are multiple articles and youtube videos regarding how to build one with PVC pipe, but the ones made with pipe look horrible and homemade.
I'm looking for some sort of jar or canister with a removable lid, roughly the size of a pop or beer can. There are plenty of screw-top continaers for cosmetics or the like, but they are awfully squatty for what I have in mind. I don't want glass -- aluminum or plastic would be OK, but a thin steel can with a removable top would be my preference. A quart paint can maybe, but I'd like it to be taller and thinner.
Ideas?
Does it have to have removable lid? I think I could probably did up the one I pulled off my Ducati. Looks something like this:
Without the screw tabs.
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@Stan Galat posted:While we're on the topic here...
I'd like to build a charcoal canister with activated charcoal for my vent tube. The one @JMM (Michael) linked would work perfectly, but costs about 10x what I want to spend to get this done. There are multiple articles and youtube videos regarding how to build one with PVC pipe, but the ones made with pipe look horrible and homemade.
I'm looking for some sort of jar or canister with a removable lid, roughly the size of a pop or beer can. There are plenty of screw-top continaers for cosmetics or the like, but they are awfully squatty for what I have in mind. I don't want glass -- aluminum or plastic would be OK, but a thin steel can with a removable top would be my preference. A quart paint can maybe, but I'd like it to be taller and thinner.
Ideas?
On Bridget I just used the one I pulled off the Legacy. Seems like those should be available at your local pick & pull?
Edit: 20 bux at flaps? What is the problem you're trying to engineer your way into?
Thanks, gents. There's also this:
For <$20 that's pretty hard to beat.
Everybody always says, "I went to the u-pull it and got one off any old thing". Have you ever looked at the charcoal canisters on vehicles? They're buried in the bowels of the car and they look pretty awful. They have eleventy-billion connections and you have zero idea if this port is on the back side of the charcoal or if that one is.
I can make a catch can work.
@Stan Galat posted:Everybody always says, "I went to the u-pull it and got one off any old thing". Have you ever looked at the charcoal canisters on vehicles? They're buried in the bowels of the car and they look pretty awful. They have eleventy-billion connections and you have zero idea if this port is on the back side of the charcoal or if that one is.
I can make a catch can work.
I'm really curious as to why you are doing this? You are the king of "these things stink and that's the way it should be", or am I wrong here?
If I was to do this (and I'm not) I'd buy a brand new one like the one Ed took off his donor. Then I'd find a vacuum hose diagram for the appropriate car it came off of to properly hook it up. Done.
FYI, my car really doesn't have any smell to it now that it's EFI, unless I open the fuel filler or lean on the tank with the frunk open. Leaning on the tank makes it burp vapors.
@DannyP posted:I'm really curious as to why you are doing this? You are the king of "these things stink and that's the way it should be", or am I wrong here?
It's a challenge. I like challenges.
There's carburetor stink (which is actually a nice smell) and overflow tube stink (which isn't). EFI can't take care of the overflow tube. I've got the same check valve in the overflow tube everybody else does right now, installed so that the tank gets pressurized if it's full and the weather is hot and I'm shaking up the contents. It's not ideal, but the needle and seat holds it and it keeps the overflow tube stink down.
@DannyP posted:I'd buy a brand new one like the one Ed took off his donor. Then I'd find a vacuum hose diagram for the appropriate car it came off of to properly hook it up. Done.
Regarding "hooking it up as per the diagram" -- you're a crazy-intelligent man, but have you ever looked at a diagram? There are solenoids activated by either the ECU or by a combination of ported and manifold vacuum. The breather is not open to atmosphere ever -- the system creates a vacuum leak into the canister to suck out the vapor, but only sometimes. So, a controlled vacuum leak? No thank you.
I could do it, sure -- but there's a LOT of space between, "you know, I'm gonna put this $4 check valve right here" and "I'm so deeply committed that I'm going to run wires from my ECU, buy a $100 relay, and run a mile of vacuum hose and create an entire ecosystem for my tank vapors".
I think having a canister full of granular activated charcoal, putting the vent tube on one side and a hole to the atmosphere on the other seems like it's worth $20. Maybe it won't work any better than the check valve, but I won't throw that away either.
Stan:
Find room for that other forward gear yet?
@Panhandle Bob posted:Stan:
Find room for that other forward gear yet?
I'm hoping that with the added torque from the latest project, I won't have to.
.
Wise men say only fools rush into such discussions, but I can't help falling for this one.
We had presumably put this one to bed ages ago, but it's turning into spring with temperatures still unseasonably chilly in many places, so folks must just be getting antsy, I guess.
First off, we don't ALL use a check valve on our vent lines to stop the fumes in a hard left turn after fill-up. It took me a few tries to get it right, but I got the proper routing and length of line figured out around year two, and it still works a treat here in year eleven.
No. Fill-up fumes. Ever.
The P-traps in domestic plumbing don't need no stinkin' check valves (see what i did there), and your faux P-car shouldn't either. Yeah, yeah, your toilet doesn't ever heat up to 120 degrees (hopefully), but that's besides the point. Proper length of hose, proper loop high enough above the filler neck, and done.
So, I'm assuming there's something about EFI that upsets the equation. The return line maybe pressurizes the tank more than carbs ever would? Bah, one more reason not to go there.
You'll shoot your eye out.
.
Stan...buddy...you'll find something that needs upgrading or change.
That's your nature!
I had the check valve mentioned above that let air into the tank but blocked air from going out.
A hot day with a full tank caused my tank's top to bulge up. I bought another tank.
I have a loop in the hose from the tank into the fender. Then, the hose is as high as possible before turning down.
I don't notice any smell.
I've got the same loop. Not sure why -- but unless I've got the check-valve, the car stinks badly enough that Mrs. Galat does not want to ride in it.
I'm looking to get away from what Michael just described. That's a lot of unregulated and uncontrolled pressure.
The fuel return line into the tank does create some turbulence that may cause a bit of stinkage with the tried and true loop-off-the-filler-neck method of Speedster Replica ventilation.
On Bridget I re-purposed the original fuel line to take the Suby engine's third (vapor) hose back to the tank area, plumbed it in there under the wood floor of the "frunk" (where no one could see it), and called it a day. It's now hooked up as if it were in the '95 Legacy wagon whence it came, so I don't know nothin' bout no solenoids and controlled vacuum leaks and whatnot. I told Tom Shiels what I was doing and left the wiring to him.
.
When liquid gas first enters the vent tube, that's what prevents the vapors behind it from ever exiting the end of the tube.
So, there has to be enough length in the tube before the top of the loop is reached to hold a decent volume of liquid gas and vapor. I gradually used longer and longer tubes before I hit the right length.
I think I've got almost four feet of tubing, coiled both inside the frunk and under the fender before the top of the loop. I have some clear plastic at the top of the loop, so I can tell that liquid fuel never reaches that point.
And it was liquid fuel that was causing most of the problem. The first vent hose (from VS) was really short and ended high up on the inside of the fender (with no loop), streaming a wide patch of gas down the inner fender on that first left turn out of the gas station.
As you burn gas, the gas in the tube is supposedly then drawn back into the tank. This simple system also prevents the buildup of any significant pressure in the tank, even though I always put the car away with a full tank (less about a quart, maybe) and the garage can get to 125 degrees on summer afternoons. I've never had gas fumes (from the tank) in the garage.
Another thing. When the car was new, I discovered the 'unvented' gas cap had plenty of vents, thus:
I was able to seal the gaps with some glue.
If you've got a dedicated vent tube, obviously you want the cap to seal tight.
.
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When I removed the charcoal canister from my Ducati, I replaced it with a cheap plastic fuel filter to keep the dirt/bugs out of the vent line. I did the same with the vent in my Spyder, inside the wheel well. I’ve never noticed any gas smell with either.
I think I have the Sacto-McKelvey method. Make a loop (inverse P-trap) and run the hose out of the car. Seems to work. I took the one-way valve out to avoid pressurizing the tank when it gets too hot. I had a big problem there once and wish not to repeat that. I sense some fumes on a full tank in hard left hand turns. No biggie for me. And it's a convertible and has a LOT of ventilation. Right seater has never complained, but her presence is infrequent, and her trips are typically short.
And Stan mentioned the "good" carburetor gas smell. Well, OK, I guess. Again I get it, but so what. Does not seem to liger and causes no problem (that I know of). But I will admit to this: When these engines, which are largely aluminum, run as they are supposed to and get properly hot, I find that when you turn them off and linger at the rear hatch they give off what I would call a very distinctive smell. I cannot describe with words what this smell is other than properly hot metal in an air cooled system, mixed with -- ?? Anyway, both of my real 356s produced this smell and I routinely give the Speedster a sniff test after I turn it off after a good run to see if I can detect anything different. Weird, huh?
@Sacto Mitch posted:.
When liquid gas first enters the vent tube, that's what prevents the vapors behind it from ever exiting the end of the tube.
So, there has to be enough length in the tube before the top of the loop is reached to hold a decent volume of liquid gas and vapor. I gradually used longer and longer tubes before I hit the right length.
I think I've got almost four feet of tubing, coiled both inside the frunk and under the fender before the top of the loop. I have some clear plastic at the top of the loop, so I can tell that liquid fuel never reaches that point.
And it was liquid fuel that was causing most of the problem. The first vent hose (from VS) was really short and ended high up on the inside of the fender (with no loop), streaming a wide patch of gas down the inner fender on that first left turn out of the gas station.
As you burn gas, the gas in the tube is supposedly then drawn back into the tank. This simple system also prevents the buildup of any significant pressure in the tank, even though I always put the car away with a full tank (less about a quart, maybe) and the garage can get to 125 degrees on summer afternoons. I've never had gas fumes (from the tank) in the garage.
Another thing. When the car was new, I discovered the 'unvented' gas cap had plenty of vents, thus:
I was able to seal the gaps with some glue.
If you've got a dedicated vent tube, obviously you want the cap to seal tight.
.
fwiw, on the Spyder I installed a pretty big tube (cuz I had it) reaching up to just under the fill cap. That prevents sloshing. Then I plumbed it to my 550-esque fuel tank cover, and from then out in the normal (legit 550) way.
Happy to report this works well, with no leaks or significant fumes.
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This smell is part of the experience on old VWs and Porsches. Your clothes always end up smelling like gas and exhaust fumes after driving 